Tuesday February 9th, 2010
- Last update:14 hours 49 min ago
Court orders list of PNM membership for Panday
Published: 29 Sep 2009
Geoffrey Robertson, QC, leaves the Hall of
Justice yesterday. Photo: KEITH MATTHEWS
British Queen’s Counsel Geoffrey Robertson made an unusual request in court yesterday. On behalf of his client, Basdeo Panday, political leader of the UNC, Robertson asked the assistant general secretary of the ruling PNM, Rose Janierre, to supply the court, among other things, with a list of the membership of the PNM. Janierre, a former Mayor of Arima, was being cross-examined in a judicial review case brought by Panday and his wife Oma, over the decision of Magistrate Ejenny Espinet not to recuse herself from hearing a bribery case, on the ground of apparent bias.
Janierre, who has been a member of the PNM since 1980, was asked whether she knew of Alexander Chamberlain Alexis, a founding member of the PNM and a former minister in the Eric Williams government, and Espinet’s father. Questioned by Robertson, Janierre said she had found no resignation or expulsion of Alexis from the party. She pointed out that the records of the PNM were computerised in 1993, so it was likely that issues dealing with the party before that might not have been retrieved.
Janierre said she knew as a fact that Attorney General John Jeremie was a member of the PNM, because he joined the party quite recently. She said there was a printout of the list of all PNM members, all of whom were required to pay dues. If they didn’t, they would not be able to vote during the party’s convention. The former mayor said she did not know Alexis. She never saw him at Balisier House or at party functions. Robertson then requested a list of the PNM membership, the lifetime members, and whether Alexis was a member of the ruling party from its inception in 1956.
Janierre agreed, but said it would be tedious. Justice Vasheist Kokaram, who is hearing the matter in the Port-of-Spain High Court, asked Janierre to try her best to have the list prepared for presentation in court this morning. He even evoked laughter in court when he told Janierre to buy a bottle of coffee on her way to Balisier House. He asked that both sides look at the list before the start of the hearing. Assisting Robertson are Anand Beharrylal and Mickela Panday. Douglas Mendes, SC, and Ian Benjamin represent Espinet.
Panday, Leader of the Opposition, and his wife are charged with accepting a bribe of £25,000 from businessmen Ishwar Galbaransingh and Carlos John. He said the committal proceedings began before Espinet on May 31, 2006. It was not until February 12, 2008, that the Pandays received information that the magistrate was a trustee and treasurer of an organisation named the Morris Marshall Development Foundation, in Laventille. They argued that the magistrate never disclosed her involvement in the foundation to any of the parties before her.
Robertson, in his submissions, revealed that the foundation was situated in the constituency of Laventille, a PNM stronghold. He pointed out that Morris Marshall was a member of Parliament for the PNM, a party opposed to Panday’s UNC. Robertson said Espinet was introduced to the foundation by Jeremie. He said among the 15 names on the foundation, ten were associated with the PNM, including the current Minister of National Security, Martin Joseph. “How could she put that out of her mind when she is judging the PNM’s political enemy? Robertson asked. “She had a duty to let the parties know she was the daughter of a PNM hero and founder, that she was introduced by John Jeremie to become a trustee.”
PEOPLE STILL WANT TO KNOW
PEOPLE STILL WANT TO KNOW -
People still want to know why some people are hesitant to move from the Privy Council to the CCJ. The only ones who would not hesitate would be PNM-ites but if the shoe was on the other foot they would hold on to it for dear life and claim Ethnic Cleansing like one of their activist did on the radio.
CCJ LIKELY TO
CCJ LIKELY TO DISCRIMINATE
The simple reason is that people are concerned that the CCJ could discriminate both politically and ethnically in its decision, given the kind or polarization that exists in T & T and elsewhere in the region.
When the CCJ was first
When the CCJ was first brought up, the shoe was on the other foot. The UNC was in government, and the PNM in opposition. The UNC signed on, and the PNM gave their support, thus allowing the headquarters to be located here.
The UNC's opposition to the CCJ is simply part of plan to oppose everything, and make life difficult for the ordinary citizen, then blame the government. Rather irresponsible for a 'loyal' opposition.
RAMESH CLARIFIES
RAMESH CLARIFIES -
RAMESH on CNC3 clarified that the agreement was on the condition of an education process and a referendum by the people. There are many positions that PNM took in Opposition that it did not support in Government don't be one sided. PNM came into power under the banner of MASSA DAY DONE. Who is raiding the treasury a white foreigner Hart? Who they try to lock up a black man Rowley? UNC has many faults but you are cherry picking to make PNM look blameless.
He didn't say so in
He didn't say so in 1998!
death penalty news- worldwide
________________________________________
To Multiple recipients of list
From Rick Halperin
Date Wed, 24 Jun 1998 09:50:42 -0500
Reply-To deathpenalty@assocdir.wuacc.edu
Sender deathpenalty@assocdir.wuacc.edu
________________________________________
6-24-98--
TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO:
The British government has given Trinidad and Tobago the green light to
press ahead with its plans to abolish appeals in murder cases and
constitutional motions relating to the death penalty to the Judicial
Committee of the Privy Council.
However, appeals in civil cases and constitutional motions will
continue to be forwarded to the London-based Privy Council. The British
government has agreed not to remove jurisdiction in the civil arena.
Attorney General Ramesh Lawrence Maharaj and Britain's Lord Chancellor,
Lord Irvine of Lairg, held discussions at the House of Lords in London
yesterday.
When contacted in London last night, Maharaj told the Guardian the
discussions were fruitful and he was happy with the outcome of the
meeting. He was accompanied to the meeting by Clive Pegus of the
Trinidad and Tobago High Commission in London.
Yesterday's meeting was a follow-up to one which Maharaj held on April
23with the Lord Chancellor in London.
Based on discussions, Maharaj added, "The Trinidad and Tobago Government
can now proceed to take steps to abolish appeals in murder cases and
constitutional motions without having to worry that the British
government would discontinue all appeals from this country."
The AG said there was some concern that should the Government withdraw
just murder appeals, the British Government could give up jurisdiction
in all matters and there could be a constitutional crisis for this
country.
"But there is no problem where that is concerned. The meeting today was
very positive and I can safely say that our Government can go ahead and
take steps to abolish appeals in murder cases and constitutional motions
relating to murder cases."
Maharaj said these appeals can now go towards the proposed Caribbean
Supreme Court. In the absence of such a court, Maharaj said on his
return to Trinidad he would have to seek an alternative final court for
Trinidad and Tobago. He could not say when the Caribbean Supreme Court
would become a reality.
The AG said that under the Constitution, there are certain appeals which
must go as of right to the Privy Council. These include constitutional
motions, civil cases, claims of $15,000 and over, and any matter
involving the interpretation of the Constitution.
Maharaj pointed out that in criminal cases, petitions have to be sent to
the Law Lords for leave to appeal against conviction and sentence.
"If the Government of Trinidad and Tobago wants to withdraw certain
appeals, it must discuss the matter with the British Government and come
to some decision," Maharaj added.
The government is seeking to abolish appeals in murder cases in an effort
to clear the way to execute convicted killers.
Following the 1993 Pratt and Morgan decision, the TT Government has
been unable to carry out the death penalty. The Privy Council gave
countries 2 years to conclude the appeal process in their respective
states, and a further 18 months to deal with petitions before
international human rights agencies.
The government has already indicated its intention to withdraw from the
United Nations Commission on Human Rights and the Inter-American
Commissionon Human Rights.
There have been calls to keep the Privy Council until the Caribbean
Supreme Court is established. The Opposition People's National Movement
(PNM) believes that the abolition of appeals to the Privy Council should
have been discussed in Parliament before Maharaj held talks with the Lord
Chancellor.
DID HE HAVE PNM SUPPORT
DID HE HAVE PNM SUPPORT -
Did PNM support it at the time? Having a discussion is not necessarily a final position. The cabinet would have had to give approval and if you do not have the votes, you would need opposition support. You may then have to hold your hand or use another approach e.g. a referendum.
'Show me yours and I'll show
'Show me yours and I'll show you mine', could be appropriate here. What is this for, to see whose list is bigger?
It would be interesting to see this list, since many members from both Mr Panday's and Mr Manning's parties probably hold two, three, or multiple party cards?
ajfyzabadbutlertown
You are sure right. When NAR
You are sure right. When NAR won the election in 1985, certain PNM diehards were outside NAR HQ showing their jubilation, hoping to be seen to be seen to be able to benefit from their rank sycophantic opportunism. And would you believe that many succeeded at the expense of the real NARites? These people run with the hares and the hounds and change political parties and allegiances like socks for expediency. Nothing wrong with genuine change if your principles become at variance with your Party's or rather the other way round. But that is for those with principles and conscience, unfortunately dying values today.
COMMON SENSE
COMMON SENSE -
Now ah hearing some sense, examples
1) Montanos PNM and UNC
2) Bermudez brothers
3) CLICO backed UNC and PNM
4) Maraj brothers PNM and UNC.
5) Don't talk about the Political Vagrants who move from part to party.
6) Chin Lee Family, PNM and UNC.
7) Mohammed Family
8) Most companies support all a parties; whosoever wins their business will not suffer.
9) My Family, and many T&T families.
But least we lose sight; these allegiances can influence your judgement. Sometimes we forget the claims of Ethnic Cleansing, first by a PNM Activist and then by a UNC MP. We can remember Petrosingh and claims of Afro Hospital. To project these prejudices to one side is not being FAIR and BALANCED.
Ramesh clarifies What Ramesh
Ramesh clarifies
What Ramesh did not explain on that CNC3 interview was why the UNC was then in support of the establishment of the CCJ. The question of their supporting the CCJ then or now is separate and apart from the confirmation of public support by referendum or otherwise. Are they still in support of a CCJ or not?
Or is it their view that a CCJ is good if you have a UNC government if power but not good if you have a PNM government.
I still maintain that Basdeo
I still maintain that Basdeo Panday should've NEVER been PM if it was'nt for his party's close connection to Abu Bakh thru Ramesh Maharaj's representing him in the 80's with the land eviction matter in POS courts, the UNC skillfully used Bakh to gain sympathy for indians who made up the majority of illegal land squatters in central.
Bakh ONLY came to national attention thru this legal issue, the Islamic Frankenstein by way of power a hungry indian party & its leaders.
BALANCE AND FAIRNESS
BALANCE AND FAIRNESS -
A Lot of what you have said is true. But are you are telling me that,
1) The COUP did not resurrect the PNM who had three seats, and under heavy investigation of further corruption. They would have been virtually wiped off the political landscape.
2) Are you telling me that Manning and Marshall were not marching with SEPOS as acts of civil disobedience?
3) You are telling me that ABU Bakr was not a leader in SEPOS.
4) You are telling me that ABu Bakr did not think he had support from PNM, Unions and Civil Society.
5) Abu Bakr did not campaign for PNM in the last election.
6) That Abu Bakr claimed that he was made promises for said support.
7) That an ex-Jamat member is now a Minister.
8) That Guerra who was a PNM activist was not a Jamat member.
9) That Bilal who was a government consultant was not a Jamat member.
10) That members and ex-members of the Jamat some just out of jail were not given lucrative URP and CEPEP contracts.
Boy you so one sided you like a broken down cabinet. A PNM cabinet tuh boot.
That members and ex-members
That members and ex-members of the Jamat some just out of jail were not given lucrative URP and CEPEP contracts...Quote
Everyone in T&T knows that members of BOTH parties played with Bakh, but the FACTS speak for themselves.
URP was handed over by the "You ain't see" gov't under Panday recall the famous or infamous picture of Bakh and newly "elected" (UNC did NOT win ANY landslide) PM Panday at the twin towers.(the Express) FACT show me a picture of Manning with Bakh!
During the 1990 hostage crisis the main demand that the insurgents made was that "Robinson resign and in his resignation letter he should appoint Panday as PM". FACT! (WHY???)
In the parliament building both NAR & PNM members were tied up one PNM MP was killed, NONE of the UNC members were tied up in fact they were FREE to walk around! one even hid the "amnesty documents" on his person to PREVENT the soldiers from finding it.
This document was then used to FREE Bakh from jail by way of UNC deputy leader Ramesh Maharaj actions in the Privy council. FACT (Thanks for ALL your help over the yrs)
Under whom watch was CEPEP
Under whom watch was CEPEP and UDeThief formed? Who was this benefactor of the lucrative handouts form CEPEP and UDeThief? So the community leaders control the gangs, who is holding the country hostage now? Who is in charge, then a man want to talk about 2500 youths dead, ok most are black youths, that are robbing and killing the general public and then killing each other, Still want to live in the past, can the past solve our present problems? So what are you trying to say lock up panday and our problems are solved? Come on Mike what is the solution, tell the people, Only one solution, get rid of the people that have taken us down this road, now did you pay attention to the PM speech to the UN, what was the cause for our problems, ok so you tell me all them youths are a direct result of what our PM blamed the problems on, who shut down the sugar industry and put people out of work, who tell the same people he going to make them farmers, who tell the same people we have to go to court to fight for land now, who giving land to PNM supporters and ministers using etech, who spending who money to fight the people, who create 10,000 skilled workers and still giving the contracts to the Chinese, who have a war going on with every union in the country, who supporting the Chinese to come to Trinidad and Tobago and not supporting the local business men, we can go on mike, who you want to blame now, you acting just like the PNM, lets blame someone, ok I blame you mike for putting these madmen to run my country to the ground!
UNC Nothng Yet, UNC Manning and Hart going to get lock up, UNC Rowley runing the PNM. So you realy don`t see.
MikeSamuel BEHAVE YOURSELF
MikeSamuel
BEHAVE YOURSELF
.. Your behaviour is not a pretty sight.
Look in the mirror and really see what's looking back at you.
I think Mike should go back
I think Mike should go back and check some of his "facts".
Eg: Was the Minister who died from his wounds not an NAR minister? He could not have been a PNM minister since the Patrick National Movement (PNM) (ask Muriel) was a minority opposition party. The budding dictator then sought to destroy all internal opposition: Muriel, & the popular Morris Marshall who was to die later of a broken heart.
Did Bakr want Panday as PM or was it Dookeran, the NAR Planning Minister that he wanted as PM? And didn't Dookeran decline the offer, not that Bakr was in any position to offer anything to anyone?
There were 3 elected PNM MPs at the time. How many of these 3 were present in Parliament on that fateful 27th July 1990? And where was their Leader at the time? And why does he object to an official enquiry of the whole rotten affair while many of those with information are still alive and can provide useful insights, whether by sworn affidavits or otherwise?
And forget about the official leader of the opposition who was said to be in a deep sleep. He is still in a deep sleep. That is why the PM can return the compliment: as long as Panday is leader of opposition, he Manning will be PM and later Executive Dictator, you might add. They must have a good thing going.
And who wanted to give away prime State property to said Bakr and was forced to do aU-turn when his nemesis Rowley and a few other testicularly endowed stood up and objected strongly to this madness?
Malice, hatred and bigotry can blind you to such a degree that you really can't see fact from fiction, youentsee? This is what is keeping back T&T from achieving its fullest potential. Thank God that people with that kind of mentality are in a small minority. They can't even see beyond their nose and every issue is a race issue. And if you dare to criticise any foolish action or talk by the PNM government or its leader you are Indo and youentsee. If so, at least 85 % of Trinbagonians must be Indos and Youentsees.
The Prince My "Prince" was
The Prince
My "Prince" was this meant for me or MikeSamuels.
'cause you started off aimed at one and I think you changed your loyalty at the end.
Anyhow the info was well worth reading ... as I was offshore at the time and missed some of it.
Please don't let the likes of these get to you.
A level head is always welcomed.
Chin up .. Gardenia, your friend.
Sorry Gardenia if my
Sorry Gardenia if my comments appeared misdirected. They were merely building on your entreaty to Mike Samuel, appealing to him to check his "facts" against my own recollection of events.
My apologies if my intentions were misunderstood.
I do try to rise above the banal bacchanal, but sometimes you can't see nonsense and remain indifferent. But I did try to keep a cool head, even if it did not appear so.
I myself was away during the maelstrom, but was back shortly. My news was a bit 2nd hand but I got a vivid account from my good friend the late Dr St George who was Dep. Speaker. He showed me the scars left on his wrists from being hog-tied, not to mention the mental scars which caused him nightmares and residual trauma with flashbacks. His car was also shot up and he was having trouble with insurance which usually does not cover riots and insurrection etc. He also recounted how his "jailor" tightened his knots when he begged for them to be slackened a bit and how they were left filthy from all their bodily functions.
We have lost his testimony which could have been presented to an Enquiry.
Please don't pay no heed to
Please don't pay no heed to me poking fun in your direction.
I read it and at first wonder .. huh ??
Read it again and confirmed that it was not coming my way.
I know sometimes that ignorance and arrogance wears us down.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but I don't think anyone can appeal to those in that group. They have an agenda and a mindset that is cast in concrete, and will keep poking away at anyone with an intelligent brain. But we can still relish in the fact knowing their numbers are still small ..
Chip up and keep smiling ... We do have staying power, don't we?
Gardenia
Better believe it. Tomorrow
Better believe it. Tomorrow is another day, thanks be to God.
I used the word appeal advisedly, as some would say. Even Robbie said he thought there was hope yet when the insurrectionist handed him a note from his wife. He said this here is a human being; St George probably did not share that view of the one who showed him no mercy.
Maybe your friend had a bad experience which has coloured or poisoned his mind, unless he was born so. He needs some professional help and soon at that.
You take care now.
The one and only Prince.
DID YOU NOTICE
DID YOU NOTICE -
How he cleaverly evaded points 5 to 9, no comment. Maybe he agrees with them. Even Mr Hart said that the Jamat campaigned for PNM.
WHAT ABOUT PAY OFF TO GANGS
WHAT ABOUT PAY OFF TO GANGS -
Gladiator a PNM activist accused Mackey another PNM activist on one of his radio programmes of being assigned to pay off gangs before the elections to keep the crime down. This made it look like PNM was solving the crime problem.The crime went down and after elections it went up again, most of the murders were the said gang leaders. There is a saying in the crime world dead men tell no tales.
We have people in this
We have people in this country that so worried about one MP getting killed 10+ years ago by 40 or so tugs, but not worried about the 2500 the CoP confirmed dead, and the uncounted victims that are killed on our soil, So Who is the real terrorist. The Coup was a joke; look at your reality now! “PNM till we dead”, I see that is a real statement! So Manning, they have a saying kill one man you are a murder, kill 1,000,000 you are a conquer, I know Manning will not make it to greatness to kill 1,000,000 so I guess that qualifies you to be a dictator.